- As your child gets older, how do you deal with trying to help raise a child that you're far away from?

And how does your child adjust to having your mother in prison?

- A lot of phone calls while you're still in.

I don't think children do adjust.

I think it's one of those traumas that sits with you and you begin to identify with as you get older, much like losing a parent to death, you know?

My daughter is still dealing with it now.

- How old is she now?

- And she's 14 years old.

- Okay, tough age.

- Right.

So think of that.

And she's dealing with the hormones and all of that, and she's also dealing with those traumas of not having her mom for the first nine years of her life.

- Yeah, that is tough.

Wow.

Kaitlyn, what have you seen, and what do we see typically from kids who don't have that parent in their lives every day, parents who are facing a prison sentence?

- It's a tough situation.

Like Nia said, you know, your parent plays such an important role in your life.

And with the placement of all Illinois prisons, you know, if you're from Chicago, you're not gonna be able to go out and visit your parent that often unless you're in some of these programs.

And even if you're in these programs, like you said, the facilities are just sort of inaccessible.

I don't know if you've ever heard of ACEs, adverse childhood experiences.

It's a psychology term for the type of compounding trauma a child can go through.

And I believe one of those is to have a parent that's incarcerated, like that is how impactful it is, that it is factored into these psychological tests.

Because I think it's, you know, your parent is somebody that you can sort of feel safe with in expressing all sorts of emotions.

And, you know, there's a limited ability to have that safe place with a parent while they're inside.

But then also, you know, a lot of times when mothers return home, it's not just going through the experience of reentry and dealing with all that is tough with coming back into society, but now, you have to be somebody's mom, somebody's mom out of nowhere.

And there's not a lot of supports for women generally coming out of prison, but especially when you factor in all of the responsibilities that come with coming out and automatically being thrust into motherhood when you're not used to that, and maybe even the child is not used to you playing that role yet.

And so I think that's a thing that people really need to discuss more, right?

It's not just that initial separation.

It is just this sort of compounding tear at that root wound.