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deposition of haroun fazul's wife

COURT OF APPEAL
OF MORONI
TRIBUNAL OF FIRST INSTANCE
OF MORONI
CABINET
OF MR DJAFFAR
EXAMINING MAGISTRATE

TRANSCRIPT OF DEPOSITION

Eighteenth of September Nineteen Ninety-Eight

At 9 hour(s) 45 before us, DJAFFAR AHMED SAID

Examining Magistrate at the Tribunal of First Instance of Moroni.

[...]

The witness replied:

My name is HALIMA BADROUDINE FAZUL born on 4 October 1976 in DJOIEZI-MOHELI.

Profession: House-keeper

Residence: Moroni-Magoudjou

Wife of the suspect

I married Fazul on April 4, 1994. Fazul wanted to get married with a woman from his family. He asked my parents and they accepted. I was studying in school. I didn't know Fazul before my marriage. I was born in Moheli. I saw Abdallah Fazul for the first time when he asked for my hand in marriage. Three weeks after our wedding, he took me to Kenya. We stayed in that country until December 1994 and then we left.

Q: WHY DID YOU TRAVEL TO SUDAN IN 94?

A: Fazul told me that he had a job in Sudan working on computers in Khartoum.

Q: WHAT WORK WAS HE DOING ON YOUR ARRIVAL IN KENYA IN 1994?

A: He was learning about computers.

Q: WHAT WAS THE ADDRESS OF YOUR HUSBAND'S EMPLOYER IN KHARTOUM?

A: I don't know as I left the house rarely. I simply went to visit others in the Comoran community in Sudan. My husband never spoke about where he worked. We spent two years there.

Q: WHY DID YOU NEVER ASK YOUR HUSBAND ABOUT WHERE HE WORKED?

A: I did ask him. Each time, he said that it was in Khartoum. He never spoke about his salary and I never saw him with more than $300. Between 1994 and 1996, he never left Sudan. He traveled around the country.

Q: IN THIS PERIOD DID HE BRNIG ANY FRIENDS TO THE HOUSE?

A: Only Comoran students came to visit us.

Q: WHO WAS THE GIRL CALLED AMINA WHO VISITED YOU IN SUDAN?

A: She is Abdallah's sister, who lives in Paris and who passed through Sudan by plane. I did nothing in Sudan. I simply brought up my child. I do not know the address of our house in Sudan in 1995. We returned to the Comoros in May 96 with Fazul and my child. I stayed for two months and he left three weeks later. I returned to Kenya in June and Fazul told me that he was working in a non-governmental organization.

Q: WHAT WAS THE NAME OF THIS ORGANIZATION?

A: Help Africa People. I never went to its offices. He told me that the offices were in Nairobi in the neighborhood called Embarcassy. The address is the same one where I was living. I learnt later that it was also an office.

Q: WHO IS THE FRIEND OF FAZUL CALLED WADIA?

A: He worked with Fazul at Help Africa People. I think that he was the Director. He was American and his wife is a white American. She is called April Ray and her and her husband are Muslims. She dressed in a jellaba. Mrs April Ray has three children, called Abdallah, Soifa and Issa.

When this couple left for the United States, they did not give us their address. Anyway, I was in Mombassa at that time. I had taken the children to Mombassa in March 97. Abdallah came to visit to pay for my tuition and my living expenses.

Meanwhile Abdallah went to the Comoros when his mother died. On return to Mombassa, he spoke of his trip to Sudan in October 97. He told me that he had found work in Sudan.

Q: DID HE TELL YOU WHAT WORK?

A: He told me that his employer was a company called Wadi al Mabarak. We arrived in Sudan in November and he left Sudan at the end of December. He told me that he was heading to Nairobi. He did not tell me why.

Q: IN ONE OF YOUR LETTERS TO YOUR PARENTS YOU WROTE THAT THEY SHOULD NOT GET WORRIED AS YOUR HUSBAND'S EMPLOYERS TOOK CARE OF YOU. WHO WERE THESE EMPLOYERS?

A: They were Sudanese, from the Wadi al Mabarak company. The wife of one of my husband's employers, called Hadia, brought me money. I don't know her husband's name. Anyway, this man took Fazul to the airport. I think I remember his name. It is Tarek Mohamed Omar, but I'm not certain.

Fazul wrote to me once from Kenya in January 1998. He came back to Sudan in February and stayed for a month. He told me that he'd forgotten some papers about his computers. Then he returned to Nairobi.

He came back to Sudan in April 1998 and told that we were leaving for Nairobi, because we had found lodgings there. He did not tell me that he had found a job in Nairobi, simply that we were going there. I think that before leaving for the Comoros on August 7, we stayed for three months in Kenya. We lived at 43, New Rudacastit. I lived with him and my children. Some friends of mine visited me. My father came for some health care.

Q: WHO WERE THOSE FRIENDS?

A: (Looking at police photos) I have never seen these faces, but the American police showed me these photos. I told them that I did not recognize them.

Q: DO YOU KNOW AZZAM JIHAD ALI?

A: No.

Q: AND SALEH, WHO MIGHT BE EGYPTIAN?

A: No. I do not know Khaled, nor Bilal, a cousin of Ahmed, nor Abdul Rahman, nor Ahmed aka Abdullah Ahmed. My husband's name was Abdullah Mohamed. I do not know Khalid Salim Saleh nor ben Rashid.

Q: WHILE YOU WERE LIVING ABROAD WITH YOUR HUSBAND, DID HE TELL YOU THAT HE WAS LEAVING FOR PAKISTAN?

A: No. Never.

Q: HAVE YOU EVER VISITED PAKISTAN?

A: I have never been to that country.

Q: TELL US EVERYTHING YOU KNOW ABOUT THE EGYPTIAN WHO WORKED WITH YOUR HUSBAND AND WHO CONSIDERED FAZUL A BROTHER AND WHO HAS A SON CALLED KHALED?

A: It was in 95 when we were in Sudan. He was a friend of my husband. I don't know if he was Egyptian, but his wife is. His son is called Khaled. I breast-fed him. My husband worked with the man in a company called Wadi Al Aqiqi, which is in the oil and road construction business. My husband worked on computers there. I don't know that man's name, nor his wife's. We were neighbors in Khartoum, Zoubert Road, right next to a supermarket.

Q: WHAT WAS YOUR LAST ADDRESS IN SUDAN?

A: Khartoum SOBA, right next to a yogurt factory, by the Soba Hospital.

Q: WHY DID YOUR HUSBAND CALL HIMSELF HARUN?

A: As soon as we arrived in Kenya in 94, he told that everyone called him Harun here and so, from then on, I called him Harun.

Q: DIDN'T HE TELL YOU THE MEANING OF THIS WORD?

A: No.

Q: AND YET IT WAS HIS `NOM DE GUERRE' - FIGHTING NAME?

A: He did not tell me that.

Q: DO YOU KNOW A MAN CALLED SIKANDER?

A: Yes, I know him. He came to the house. He's Indian. He lives in Nairobi. When Fazul came to take me to Sudan in 98, we went first to his house before settling in our own house. He lived in Park Land.

Q: CAN YOU TELL ME WHY ON THE TELEPHONE IN KENYA HE SPOKE TO YOU ABOUT SOMEONE WHO WANTED TO SPEAK TO YOU? WHO WAS THAT MAN?

A: It was a man who was looking for Fazul. He didn't tell me his name. It was August 6th; the day before our departure. I met Sikander in 98, but I know he has been a friend of my husband for some time. We got on well. He has a small shop.

Q: BEFORE YOUR DEPARTURE FOR NAIROBI ON AUGUST 7, WHICH PEOPLE CAME TO VISIT?

A: Sikander and his family and his sisters and that was to say goodbye to my father. And two Kenyans, Fahad and Cheik, who came to see me. They are from Mombassa. I don't know their surnames. When we left for the airport, my husband took me in a Suzuki car, followed by a car belonging to Sikander's sister who brought our luggage. She's called Mounira Mohamed Djoumoi. The day before we left, my husband wasn't anxious. I found him calm. He was taking care of my father's trip.

Q: WHY DID YOU LEAVE ON AUGUST 7?

A: That was the day we had the ticket for and the doctor's note allowing my father to travel.

Q: WHY DIDN'T FAZUL TRAVEL WITH YOU?

A: I don't know. Fazul didn't tell me if we were leaving definitively for the Comoros.

Q: DID YOUR HUSBAND WARN YOU THAT HE WOULD RETURN TO THE COMOROS ON AUGUST 14?

A: He told me that he would come to the Comoros in the second week. He came in a taxi to the house. It was a Friday.

Q: WHICH PEOPLE CAME TO VISIT HIM?

A: The family. And a Mr Djaffar, who came with his wife. It is the wife that I know. She lives in the district Sans Fil. She was studying in Sudan. She's called Fatouma Hadji. She too studied at Soidiki's school.

Q: DO YOU KNOW IF YOUR HUSBAND STUDIED AT SOIDIKI'S SCHOOL?

A: He told me that when we got married. I too studied at Soidiki's. Soidiki did not visit me.

Q: DID YOU SEE THE LETTER THAT YOUR HUSBAND SENT OMAR, HIS BROTHER, IN WHICH HE SAID THAT HE KNEW HOSE TO HANDLE WEAPONS?

A: Two weeks ago, Omar told me that this letter had been taken and that Fazul had written it when he studied in Pakistan and that was before he married me.

Q: WHY DID YOU SAY IN YOUR LETTER TO YOUR FAMILY DID YOU TELL YOUR RELATIVES NO TO GIVE OUT YOUR ADDRESS AND NOT TO SHOW YOUR PHOTO TO ANYONE?

A: I was scared for the rest of my family. I didn't want anyone to give my children the evil eye.

Q: WHY DID YOU NOT LEAVE FOR THE AIRPORT TO SAY GOODBYE TO YOUR HUSBAND ON AUGUST 22?

A: I stayed alone with my father who is ill.

Q: WHERE WAS HE GOING?

A: To Pakistan.

Q: WHY THERE?

A: I don't know, but I recall that one day in Kenya in 98, he told me that he would return to Pakistan on secondment.

Q: THAT MEANS THAT HIS BOSSES WERE IN PAKISTAN?

A: I don't know.

Q: DID YOU MENTION FAZUL TO OMAR SINCE YOU HAVE BEEN IN THE COMOROS AND THAT FAZUL'S WAS BEING SEARCHED FOR?

A: No.

Q: MAIMOUNA IS WHOSE SISTER?

A: Maimouna is my sister. She died in 1995.

Q: AND AMTOULA FAZUL?

A: She is a sister of mine by the same father, but we don't have a relationship. My father has worked at Kalfane for 28 years.

Q: IN YOUR OPINION, WHERE DID YOUR HUSBAND GET THE MONEY FOR HIS TICKETS?

A: Maybe his employers.

Q: DO YOU KNOW THAT THIS MORNING, A $3 MILLION DOLLAR BOUNTY HAS BEEN PUT ON YOUR HUSBAND'S HEAD? HOW DO YOU COUNT ON LIVING WITH YOUR CHILDREN?

A: I don't know.

Q: DO YOU HAVE THE SAME POLITICAL AND RELIGIOUS VIEWS AS YOUR HUSBAND?

A: I didn't know.

Q: HAVE YOU SEEN FAZUL WITH MULTIPLE PASSPORTS?

A: I knew that he traveled with a Comoran passport and that another, full passport was at home. I didn't go with Fazul to the Immigration Office on August 21 for his visa.

Q: DID YOU KNOW THAT HE HAD A VISA FOR PAKISTAN WHICH EXPIRED IN DECEMBER 1998?

A: I knew that in Nairobi, he was trying to get a visa for Pakistan. He told me before his departure for Pakistan that he would write to me or telephone me, but that while he was traveling, he would not write. He would telephone only when he arrived. He told me that he bought a three-month return ticket Moroni-Pakistan, Pakistan-Moroni. Fazul never told me that he used weapons or that he knew how to handle them. I don't know the insititute where Fazul studied computers in Pakistan. I know that, before studying computers, he studied Arabic.

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